CURTIS CONFRONTS CCP ON SURVEILLANCE AND INFLUENCE EFFORTS ON U.S. LAWMAKERS, STATE AND LOCAL GOVERNMENTS
Washington, D.C. – During a Foreign Relations Committee hearing titled “The Malign Influence of the People’s Republic of China at Home and Abroad: Recommendations for Policy Makers,” U.S. Senator John Curtis (R-UT) spoke with Mr. Peter Mattis, President of The Jamestown Foundation, on China’s state-sponsored intellectual property (IP) theft and influence operations in the United States. During the exchange, Curtis directly addressed his “CCP handlers,” in both English and Mandarin, vowing to continue advocating for freedom and democracy, especially in Hong Kong and Taiwan.
While highlighting legislation he introduced this week to crack down on China’s IP theft, Senator Curtis asked Mr. Mattis on the extent of the Chinese government’s involvement in such activities. In response, Mattis confirmed that IP theft is not only widespread but also actively backed by both the Chinese Communist Party and the State itself, with government-organized initiatives facilitating the theft of U.S. innovations.
A transcript of the exchange between Senator Curtis and Mr. Mattis can be found below and video can be found here.
Senator John Curtis: Thank you, Mr. Chairman, Ranking Member, it’s great to be with you. Before I begin my remarks, it’s important to me to lay down some foundational principles that I believe all of us operate on. And I’ll just tell you personally, I have great respect for the Chinese people, the Chinese culture, the Chinese history. And I just want to make sure none of this this morning is about any of that. But rather a dictatorship that is hard on their own people as they are on other people.
So, let me jump in. Today, I introduced a bill aimed at increasing pressure on the Chinese, the way they address the theft of our IP. IP theft is one of the top issues I hear back about in my district, small businesses to big businesses, across the top. And I understand it’s estimated that we lose about $600 billion annually to this. So, Mr. Mattis, to what extent is China’s IP theft explicitly backed by the government as a state-sponsored initiative? Is it actively pursued by the government as a strategy, or does the government simply turn a blind eye as long as it targets Americans?
Mr. Peter Mattis: It is a policy that is backed both by the Party and the State, and that Party and State organizations are both involved in and actively organizing people to conduct that theft. In creating, for example, one of the latest innovations is overseas innovation centers to fund partnerships, and this is a constantly sort of morphing problem that we cut off one avenue and another one pops up.
They are a creative and prolific adversary, if you will, in terms of finding the holes and trying to keep those things going, especially when they can exploit third countries that may not care as much about the protection of U.S. intellectual property in the U.S.
Curtis: Thank you. Now, if I might, I’d actually like to speak to my CCP handlers. I know you’re listening. I know you try to read my emails. I know you try to read my texts. I know you try to influence me back in my home state and my staff here in Washington, D.C. So, I have a word for you. 注意听 [translated: listen carefully]. It’s not working. I’m not intimidated. And I will continue to fight for freedom and democracy around the world, especially in Hong Kong and Taiwan.
Now, Mr. Mattis, can you help us describe a little bit what subnational influence operations are and the influence that targets people within a state? And how much of the goal is it to influence state and local government, and how much it is to try to influence federal officials?
Mattis: Well, the answer of whether or not it’s also to influence the federal government as well as state and local is yes. Because, I mean, I think how many people in this chamber and in the Senate writ large, you know, began their careers as town council members, as state legislators, and others because there is a natural progression and a natural career path that that people hold.
And when you look at, you know, the attempt that was widely reported, a House member in the Bay Area, right, they were targeting, the Chinese consulate, was targeting a number of different politicians in that area.
And, you know, in your in your home state of Utah, they have certainly looked for specific connections back to the PRC and looked for ways to shape government decisions. And one of the other things that you can see there is it can be regulatory.
You know, some states required a change in their laws to allow a Confucius Institute at those universities that’s occurred. You can see it in terms of trying to push government procurement so that PRC products rather than, you know, from Huawei, from Lenovo, others rather than others that might be safer, are put into government.
And I think anything that you can describe, or that you have heard reported, as being directed at a national government, has been directed at a state and local, and the biggest difference is they lack the access to the staff resources, and oftentimes the knowledge, to be able to push back effectively.
Although I think your state has the most robust private sector in trying to identify and push back on these threats.
Curtis: Yeah. Good. Thank you. I’d like to kind of end where I began and just double down on this. My goal is that we have a strong, productive relationship with China. We don’t need to be at odds, but it has to be a relationship that’s on the equal.
You can’t steal our intellectual property. You can’t take advantage of our businesses and expect us to have the type of relationship that we need to have for not just us, for them and for the entire world. And so, thank you all. Thank you for this hearing. And I yield my time.